Author Topic: Canadian Barrel Makers.....  (Read 46037 times)

Offline Pesky ab

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Re: Canadian Barrel Makers.....
« Reply #40 on: January 23, 2014, 08:26:34 PM »
Sorry Bill , that may have been true fifteen years ago and I wouldn't know because I Wasn't shooting  br then,but today I would have to disagree with you . Having recently shot with some of the best short range br shooters in the world I can tell you these guys experiment and test and retest everything constantly and never stop looking for an edge no matter how small ,(bullets , barrels ,triggers, stocks, scopes, brass , powder you name it )  as for barrels ,the bottom line is  the reason you don't see any other barrel makers listed is because after all that exhaustive testing ,you take your best stuff to the big matches ( meaning the other stuff did not make the cut).these guys test batches of barrels now , just like batches of jackets the steel varies from run to run .consantly on the hunt for the best . There will be three br shoots at rosebud this year Bill it would be great to see you out there , the more competitors the better . And it would be great to meet you

Offline Bill Leeper

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Re: Canadian Barrel Makers.....
« Reply #41 on: January 24, 2014, 09:04:04 PM »
These guys test batches of barrels of the same make (whatever their favourite maker may be at the time). The reason they test batches of barrels (this assumes their pockets are deep enough to allow such testing and re-inforces the idea that the winners buy their way in; a contention with which I disagree) is that nobody is able to identify exactly what makes a good barrel vs a great barrel. If a barrel is perfect in all identifiable respects, it may or may not be a great barrel. If a barrel is obviously flawed, it may or may not be a turkey. It may be assumed, however, that a barrel which is straight, consistent in dimension, and smoothly finished, has greater potential to be exceptional than the flawed barrel.
Now, I have to say, I disagree with the practice of not lapping a barrel and I believe lapping may well be the most important step in producing a great barrel. Until this final finishing touch, the barrel is only potentially great. Some barrels may be good enough before lapping but they are likely to be better afterward. Also, a mediocre barrel can be improved to where it may achieve greatness. Nonetheless, I am willing to accept an unlapped barrel if I think it is basically sound because I can always lap it myself. If it doesn't work out, I have only to look in the mirror to lay blame.
I am also convinced that while most rifling configurations are just a demonstration that most anything will work well, there are configurations which are better than others for good, practical reasons.
I don't believe there is a great deal of difference between cut and buttoned barrels. Many years ago, I was quite convinced that buttoned barrels were somewhat more consistent but the ascendency of Krieger barrels over the last fifteen years or so puts the lie to this. Their practice of honing prior to rifling and lapping subsequently is a large part of their success and the guys doing the lapping should be well paid.
At one time, Ed Shilen figured that barrel straightness was immaterial as long as the barrel was not so crooked that fitting and chambering was difficult. The thing is, it doesn't take much of a curve to create a challenge when trying for a BR quality chamber and Shilen has, in recent years acknowledged this and begun straightening their barrels during manufacture (I assume this is done after drilling but prior to reaming as this makes the most sense from a machining standpoint).
Ultimately, one has to feel he is getting what he paid for and when barrels are getting into that 400 dollar range (thanks to market interference by the US State Dept.  Free enterprise, my ass!)one would hope that the necessity for trying out a batch of barrels would be a memory.
I'm hoping this is the summer our campground will take care of itself a little better and allow me to shoot a bit. We'll see what happens. I just don't have the time I need to have!   Regards,   Bill

Offline Pesky ab

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Re: Canadian Barrel Makers.....
« Reply #42 on: January 25, 2014, 12:25:42 AM »
Used to be most barrel makers were buying from crucible Since They got put under by one of the by auto  makers .barrel makers have been buying from two other steel companies , The general feeling is that the steel is not as good and seems to vary from run to run.(some barrels are going "off" in as little as 300-400 rounds ) the flavour of the day seems to be Bart's and kriegers with a few shilens for good measure, there are also some other brands but they don't seem to be as popular .  However we are always testing most of the brands out there at any given time looking for a winner .the deader the better is what you will hear a lot , meaning no weird stresses and harmonically dead . Lapping is also important as you said Bill . But the best lapping on a stressed barrel will not shoot . Stress relieving on the button barrels has also been an issue in recent times . Also a consistent twist rate on the button barrels varies from the hard inclusions  in the steel so where to cut them off is important. Cut barrels don't necessarily  have the twist issue the inclusions will show up as a possible tight spot  . That's where your dead on about the lapping on these Bill , good lapping helps them
Deep pockets won't

Offline Pesky ab

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Re: Canadian Barrel Makers.....
« Reply #43 on: January 25, 2014, 12:35:38 AM »
Deep pockets won't automatically get you a win. You do need competitive equipment . But it takes the whole package to win. That means being able to tune the rifle and read the flags . The best rifle with a hummer barrel won't win if it's poorly tuned and you make bad decisions on conditions , alternatively an average rifle will probably not win no matter who shoots it because about 10% of the rifles at the big shoots are wearing hummer barrels and are in the hands of good shooters .
Hope to see you at one of the shoots this year

 

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