Author Topic: Bedding Question  (Read 9043 times)

Offline trav_james

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Bedding Question
« on: October 06, 2010, 11:47:41 PM »
Are glue in bedding jobs on BR stocks necessary or is a proper pillar & glass enough to be competitive? Its seems to me that someone is always having a gun come unglued at the worst time.
Would a glue & pillar/glass be a better option?
I've bedded lots of stocks but haven't done a permanent glue in. I've read lots on glue in jobs, and am comfortable doing it, but it seems like a pain in the a#* having the gun glued in.
Any feedback would be appreciated
cheers
Travis James

Lawrence Hanson

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Re: Bedding Question
« Reply #1 on: October 07, 2010, 12:20:57 AM »
I have a heavy varmint benchrest rifle that was built 30 or so years ago.  It was never as accurate as I thought it should be.  Not accurate enough to win trophies at my local matches. It’s a Remington 700 in an aluminum sleeve, glued into an old McMillan stock, no bolts.  I bought it from an old time shooter who used it at matches from the Rosebud to the Cactus Classic, through temperature and pressure extremes.  This spring I took it to the gunsmith who originally built it (Arnold Erhardt) and asked him to remove the stock so that I could have it repainted properly. He tried twice but could not remove it. I said fine, and thought the bedding can’t be the problem.

My most accurate rifle is based on a Swindlehurst action bolted into a glass-bedded stock, not glued-in, no pillars, and no recoil lug.

The thing is, I don’t feel confident that there isn’t something wrong with the bedding of the glued-in rifle.  I can’t take it out and re-glue it.  So I go through several scopes and barrels only to discover it shoots the same no matter what I do.  That is driving me crazy and driving me toward selling it. 

Lawrence

Offline DanO

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Re: Bedding Question
« Reply #2 on: October 07, 2010, 09:39:51 AM »
Travis,
There has been a trend to going with a properly bedded action with pillars and not gluing it in.
BAT has advocated this method for a few years now, and I am one of folks that uses this method.
I have had a glue in go bad and could not tell the glue had partcially let go, it was only by chance that
we discovered the issue. Talk about frustration when you live through that experience.
After re-gluing it, the rifle shot back to earlier potential.
I believe that several of the shooters in Alberta are using this method, but many others still use the full
glue in method.
One persons option is that both work equally well, when done properly.

DanO


Offline RobS

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Re: Bedding Question
« Reply #3 on: October 08, 2010, 10:18:32 PM »
I would agree with Dan. Both glue in and proper pillar bedding work well. Both have won their share of trophies.

Rob

Offline Blairguy

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Re: Bedding Question
« Reply #4 on: November 28, 2010, 08:57:39 AM »
Lawrence,
I bet that it is possible to unglue it. Why not try again if the gun ain't fun the way it is now.
Some folks have reported that putting the gun in the freezer for a few days helps when it comes time to unglue an action.
Us Canucks have an ace up our sleeve....just leave the gun outside during a -30 degree night and then have at it in the morning.
« Last Edit: November 28, 2010, 09:18:27 AM by Blairguy »

Lawrence Hanson

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Re: Bedding Question
« Reply #5 on: November 28, 2010, 01:30:19 PM »
Blairguy,

Thanks for the thoughts but I sent that rifle down the road. I don’t miss it much since my light varmint gun is all I really need and it’s a better gun anyway. If I ever buy another benchrest rifle it will be glass bedded and bolted in, not glued in. I am more comfortable with a rifle that can be easily removed from the stock; it allows me to inspect the gun thoroughly, makes it a little easier to change barrels, repaint the stock, and gives me some peace of mind knowing the gun is bedded properly.   

LE Hanson   

Offline RJohansen

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Re: Bedding Question
« Reply #6 on: November 28, 2010, 05:06:50 PM »
all my rifles are screw in, I personally have never seen an advantage to a glue in. There is a bit more work to do a proper pillar bedding job, I change things up from time to time so a screw in fits me better.

Offline pac11

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Re: Bedding Question
« Reply #7 on: November 28, 2010, 09:48:58 PM »
Lawrence,

What symptoms was that glued in rifle giving you?

It might help me in something I'm working on.

Thanks
Mike

Lawrence Hanson

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Re: Bedding Question
« Reply #8 on: November 29, 2010, 05:24:47 PM »
Mike,

I had the gun for nearly three years. It shot well enough at first to make me happy, but as time went on accuracy became erratic.  It was a heavy varmint 6PPC; I put two Hart barrels, and three different scopes on it.  I tried H322 and VV-N133 powder and several different benchrest quality bullets and different shooting techniques.  It generally performed the same no matter what I tried.  I never experienced any mechanical trouble with it; my gunsmith gave it a thorough inspection when re-barreling.  When he attempted to remove the stock he didn’t notice that the bedding or anything else felt loose.  The gun was well balanced and stable on the bags. 

It had the odd tendency to string shots out in diagonal shaped groups, even on nice calm days.  See the attached practice target image.  It would string shots from 10 o’clock to 4 o’clock regardless if I shot a left-to-right wind or a right-to-left wind.  The old-timer I bought the gun from said it produced a lot of diagonal shaped groups for him too.  However, he achieved better overall accuracy from it than I did.  He’s a better benchrest shooter than I am.  Sometimes I would get fairly round shaped groups but they were nearly always large. Every once in a while I would get lucky and shoot a respectable group or two, just enough to make me think I had the gun figured out and to keep me working with it.  I would generally shoot both my heavy varmint and light varmint rifles during practice events.  Of the two, the light varmint gun would consistently perform better. I use only the light varmint rifle in group matches, in both classes. I finally realized I was wasting my time and resources on the heavy varmint rifle, and decided to let someone else have a go at making it shoot.

Probably more information than you needed but hope it helps.
LE Hanson

Offline Dennis Sorensen

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Re: Bedding Question
« Reply #9 on: December 16, 2010, 03:53:47 PM »
To remove a glue in action hold the stock level in a vise and  place an electric iron on the scope mount and plug the iron in, set it to a hot setting, and let it get hot for about 20 minutes... a little wedge under the barrel at the forend and it should come out...
After 53 years I am fully retired, unlicensed and have sold all my gunsmithing tools and lathe...
Thanks to all my customers...

Lawrence Hanson

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Re: Bedding Question
« Reply #10 on: December 16, 2010, 05:06:26 PM »
Dennis,

Thanks for sharing your experience and knowledge.

I was under the impression that freezing a sleeved action was the best way to remove it from the stock. I understand that heat, properly applied to the action, will allow a glued-in action to be removed from the stock.  But does this method also work with a sleeved action?  As I understand it, the action is glued into the sleeve. Would heat potentially de-glue the action from the sleeve?  For our collective edification, please clarify.

A happy holiday season to you and yours,
LE Hanson 

Offline Dennis Sorensen

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Re: Bedding Question
« Reply #11 on: December 16, 2010, 06:18:24 PM »
It is possible the heat will loosen the action within the sleeve, but it may not. An aluminum sleeve will heat up quickly  all around but the steel action will not and the sleeve may pop loose before the action bond is broken.

Worst case - you redo the action to sleeve... best case - the clean up of the old bedding isn't too bad and the re-bed is easy...
After 53 years I am fully retired, unlicensed and have sold all my gunsmithing tools and lathe...
Thanks to all my customers...

 

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